UPDATE: We notice that Martin Asser has since re-edited his piece, adding more details about the U.N. report into the 1996 ‘massacre’. Before anyone concludes this is an attempt to rebalance the article, however, it should be noted that while there is still no mention of Hezbollah firing mere yards away from the UNIFIL base, nor of their running for cover into the base, Asser does dwell on the U.N.’s claim that the Israeli shelling was deliberate.Only at the BBC do journalists re-edit their work in order to increase the level of anti-Israeli bias.
The left’s whining and seething over Israel’s self-defence reached fever-pitch today with news of the death-toll in Qanar. Predictably, the charge toward a ceasefire (that is, for Israel to withdraw from Lebanon while Hezbollah’s campaign of genocide goes on) is being led by the BBC. Here’s one of the Corporation’s pet Muslims, Martin Asser, attempting to upgrade a mishap to a massacre:
Analysis: A second Qana Massacre?
Well, to be fair, there’s actually a fair bit of disagreement over whether there was a first Qana massacre — Israel and the U.S. both deny this, while, lining up beside Martin Asser in order to kick Israel are the likes of George Galloway, Robert Fisk [graphic image on this one], and the moonbats at Human Rights Watch.
The southern Lebanese town of Qana is known for two events in history, and there could soon be a third as news comes in of rising civilian casualties from an Israeli air strike there.
Of course, there are also rising Hezbollah casualties, which is something the BBC seems loath to mention. After all, public sympathy for dead children is easier to generate than it is for head-hacking crazies. Whether or not Martin Asser is aware of this isn’t clear, but it’s a very safe bet that Hezbollah are.
In realms of biblical narrative, some believe it to be the scene of Jesus Christ’s first miracle, turning water into wine during the wedding at Cana of Galilee.
True enough, though quite why Asser deems this relevant to current events is anyone’s guess. Unless, of course, we’re to wake up tomorrow morning to find ‘Israel Bombs Jesus’ splashed across the BBC’s mid-east pages.
In modern times, it was the scene of one of the bloodiest events of the modern Arab-Israeli conflict, the Israeli shelling of a UN base sheltering Lebanese civilians 10 years ago.
Wow. So those evil Jooos deliberately shelled a UN compound, did they? That’s certainly the idea Martin ‘massacre’ Asser is about to plant in readers minds. The truth, of course, is that Israel was firing on a nearby Hezbollah position and missed. Asser does get around to mentioning (albeit dismissively) this explanation of events, but here, why not use the more neutral ‘Israeli shell hit a UN base’? Hmm? After all, the BBC is forever lecturing us on the importance it attaches to the use of ‘morally neutral’ language in its reporting, hence, the plethora of ‘militants’, ‘insurgents’ and ‘misguided criminals‘ which inhabit the Corporation’s reporting. Does neutrality only come into play when those responsible for civilian deaths aren’t Israelis?
International shock at those deaths - more than 100, and another 100 injured - led to huge pressure for a ceasefire deal bringing an end to Israel’s last sustained military operation against Hezbollah militants, codenamed Operation Grapes of Wrath.
Like any good propagandist, Martin Asser realises the importance of what ad-men call ‘key messaging’. If you’re selling detergent, be sure to keep mentioning how clean it leaves the kitchen sink. If you’re selling fabric softener, be sure to bang on about how soft it leaves clothes. And, if you’re selling a (unilateral) Israeli ceasefire, be sure to mention the ‘international shock’ that always accompanies Israel’s attempts to defend itself from attack.
The Qana Massacre, as it is known in Lebanon, remains a powerful symbol for Lebanese people of what they say is Israel’s indiscriminate and disproportionate response to Hezbollah’s rocket attacks.
Indeed, the Lebanese people (or, leastways, the ones who march up and down at Hezbollah rallies chanting ‘Death to Israel’) may very well believe Israel indiscriminately bombs civilians. In a region where the locals also think that Jews steal eyeballs from Palestinian children and slip contraceptive drugs into chewing gum, however, it’s unclear why this particular, nutty conspiracy theory should be the one Asser latches on to as worthy of repeating. Because it’s topical? Is that how the BBC works nowadays? Then Jews ought to brace themselves around Passover — Maybe Martin Asser will try to run with the one about them baking bread with the blood of Christian infants.
Israel still insists the 1996 shelling was an accident and that its forces had a legitimate militant target - a Hezbollah military unit that had fired mortars and rockets from near the Qana base.
Ah. Finally. Israel gets a chance to rebut the absurd allegations against it … Only, you’ll notice how Asser tries to make this sound as though the Israeli assertion that bearded crazies were firing rockets in the area is — What? — An unverifiable claim? Something obscured forever by the fog of war? Because that just isn’t true. Here’s the United Nation’s own spokeswoman, Sylvana Foa, quoting the Commander of the UNIFIL post destroyed in ‘massacre’ #1
Hezbollah guerrillas fired two Katyusha rockets and eight mortars at Israel from an area 300 yards away from the Fijian compound 15 minutes before Israeli gunners opened fire.
… So even the U.N. on the ground that day acknowledge that Hezbollah were using them as human shields? Then why doesn’t Martin Asser stir himself to mention this fact? You know, as opposed to pushing the line that this is just an accusation Israel rolls out whenever they kill someone’s kids:
Then, as now, Israel accused Hezbollah of using the civilian population as human shields when they launched their attacks.
Because then, as now, this is something even the United Nations accept is a central part of Hezbollah’s strategy. Hell, from the current war, we even have the pictures to prove it:
However, a UN investigation reported in May 1996 that the deaths at the Qana base were unlikely to have been the result of an accident as claimed by the Israelis.
This is the same U.N., we must remember, whose Commander on the ground that day confirmed Hezbollah were firing rockets in the area at the time Israel attacked. So maybe we should just file the 1996 U.N. report away in our minds as another of the organisation’s hissy-fits, a little like Koffi Anan’s tantrum when four blue-helmets were killed in similar circumstances last week?
The UN report cited the repeated use of airburst shells over the small UN compound, which sent down a deadly torrent of shrapnel that caused terrible injuries among the unprotected civilians.
The UN also noted the presence of Israeli helicopters and a drone in the skies over Qana which must have witnessed the bloodbath.
A ‘deadly torrent’? ‘Terrible injuries’? ‘Bloodbath’? Gosh, but where’s that morally neutral language the BBC are supposed to be using? And where, for that matter, is the rest of what the U.N. report had to say? You know, the part where it acknowledged the Hezbollah crazies actually took shelter inside the UNIFIL compound? Here’s the Jewish Telegraphic Agencies Cynthia Mann to fill in some of the blanks:
The U.N. report acknowledges that Hezbollah took cover at the bases of the United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon (UNIFIL).
And, again, the U.S. State Department’s Nicholas Burns:
Hezbollah used those civilians as cover in a very cynical and despicable way.
The more things change, the more they stay the same, eh?Anyway, back to Martin Asser, who, perhaps believing he’s sufficiently distorted the events of the past, moves on to the BBC’s main task of distorting events in the present:
In the current round of Israeli bombardments, Qana has again been in the news - the scene of several incidents, such as the bombing by Israel of two Lebanese Red Cross ambulances and the death of a young Lebanese photojournalist, Layal Nejib, also in an air strike on her car.
It was also the scene of leaflets like this one, dropped on Qana by the IDF days in advance of any bombs:
Looking at the map, it is not hard to see why Qana is never far from the headlines when Israel bombards southern Lebanon.
It lies at the northern edge of the Lebanon’s southern uplands which border Israel and also at the confluence of five strategic roads in the hinterland south-east of the southern city of Tyre.
So it’s just about geography, is it? The Israelis like bombing Qana because it makes an easy target? Or because of something to do with a road-network? Well, no, not really.
Qana and the villages surrounding it are a strong pro-Hezbollah area and Israel says it has repeatedly been used to fire rockets over the border about 10km (six miles) to the south.
So when Israel does the bombing, Martin Asser reports it as a ‘bloodbath’, but when the rockets come from Hezbollah, we have to take Israel’s word for it (’Israel says’)? What’s up with that? Does Asser have some reason to doubt that Hezbollah are firing rockets out of Qana? Well, then, maybe he ought to watch Fox a little more often — They’ve already aired the IDF’s video footage of the bearded-crazies doing just that.
Israeli officials say leaflets had been dropped in the area warning civilians to leave their homes so it could conduct more anti-Hezbollah operations.
Ah, yes. The leaflets which Israeli officials ’say’ they dropped. Does Martin Asser have some reason to doubt the truth of this claim as well? Or is it just that, by reporting the pro-Hezbollah position as fact and the Israeli position as claims, he helps plant doubts in the minds of his readers as to whether or not Israel can be trusted at all?Certainly, this kind of bias is subtle, but it can afford to be. See, Asser knows he can count on images of tragically-killed children being pulled from the rubble of Qana to poison minds against Israel — All he needs to do on a tragic day like today is make quite certain to give the impression he doesn’t trust the Zionist Entity one little bit. … Which is a pity, really, because when it comes to trustworthiness, it wouldn’t be Israel any journalist worth his salt would be fact-checking today.
However, it seems clear that, with the number of civilian cars and convoys which have been bombed on the roads heading to Tyre, many residents chose to ignore the Israeli warnings.
Well, war is a scary business, and we’re sure that many of the soon-to-die civilians in Qana were, indeed, reluctant to take their chances out in the open. However. This doesn’t explain why it is that they remained in the building for the eight hours between it’s being hit by an air-strike and it’s actual collapse. Not that Martin Asser would dream of pondering this issue.With him, like most of his BBC colleagues, critical scepticism only ever cuts one way.
(Cross-posted at Rottweiler Puppy)
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Dear sir
The only genocide being committed is by the Israeli Army in its ongoing expansion of Israel’s borders since 1948. What other country in the Middle East has progressively occupied so much land owned by other peoples and killed and tortured so many of them? The time has come for a single state solution, with the current Israeli Government compensating Palestinians, Lebanese and Syrians for the lands lostl the lives killed, all in the name of a deranged group of radicals in search of the mythical Greater Israel. It is time, before it is too late for innocent Israelis, for all Israelis to recognise the massive wrongs committed in their name . The day is not too far away when the US will no longer be able to support the Israeli war machine. Think!!
Comment by Paul — 7/31/2006 @ 2:48 am
STOP TELLING LIES!!! YOU ARE A MACHINE OF DISINFORMATION!!! YOU ARE AN ISRAELI SYMPATIZED WHO SPEWS OUT THE SAME CRAPSHIT AS THE ISRAELIS DO. I’M STARTING TO THINK THAT HITLER HAD A POINT AFTERALL….
YOU MAKE ME VOMIT!!!
Comment by Peace — 7/31/2006 @ 3:38 am
Talkback where it counts - The tragic Qana Incident
Help the world see Hezbollah for the terror organization it is - talkback and comment on these blogs which discuss the Qana incident. Discuss Hezbollah’s cruel use of civilians as human shields to their bombings of Israel and their refusal to allow ci…
Trackback by Giyus Blog — 7/31/2006 @ 3:42 am
The BBC writer doesnt have his facts straight…Cana of Galilee is Kfar Kana of Israel. Again, all the anti-semites unite! European Left+ right wingers +muslim. If Gd exists you will all be punished…
If not, the IDF will take care of you all, together with the US and other nations who see the danger you pose.
Comment by Anmdrei — 7/31/2006 @ 4:41 am
Hezbollah have a cruel use of civilians as human shields to their bombings of Israel and their refusal to allow civilians to leave as well as prevent UN officials to enter to aid civilian population.
here are the evidence:
Pictures showing Hezbolla’s fighters hiding in civilian areas
Hezbolla preventing civilians from leaving fighting zone
Hezbolla’s declared mission is to free the middle east of Jews
Comment by idan — 7/31/2006 @ 4:49 am
Peace you big ass. you are a big gay arab lover. and I wish that you and the palestinian who fuck you in the ass die in a gas tank like the nazi that you are.
Comment by idan — 7/31/2006 @ 4:52 am
For the last 60 years, the Arabs have been thinking that they can attack the State of Israel, loose the war and still claim back what they lost ! They think that attacking is a win-win situation. You cannot loose !
Reality is something else. As in any conflict (look Europe, for instance), borders were moved after a war. The looser….lost some territory. It is normal everywhere except with the State of Israel ? Do the Arabs think that it is just a punching ball ? They have to wake up and learn that if they attack, they will get it back, hard.
As the Israeli ambassador at the UN said: if you sleep with a missile in your home, it might happen that you don’t wake up!
Comment by Freddy Maier — 7/31/2006 @ 5:31 am
I am the universal mother-
all I want is to keep my babies well.
I am the Israeli mother-
all I want is to keep my children safe.
Therefere,I’m sending my 18th years old boys
alone in the battlefield,
pretending he is a hero-sodier,my baby,
to keep my other babies safe.
I am asking you-
you-innocent people of the world-
would you act differently had your home and babis were under flying bombs,
and fire from hell?
would you cross your hand peacefully
and wait,until you are killed,
or would you protect yourself and your family?
would you sit stll?
Or would you spit fire to the source of deadly weapons-threatenning to take away your children,your old mother,your sick father?
Would you act differently?
Romi
Comment by Romi — 7/31/2006 @ 6:57 am
In case you don’t all know about this. The Isreali’s have created a tool that they are using to alert all their supporters to articles, polls, surveys and other sites of interest that they feel need to have the opinion adjusted more to their favor . Go to http://giyus.org/ and download their tool “megaphone” so you will be alerted to the same sites in order to counter their countering efforts . 3 days ago they had a page on the link where it says “make a “difference”" that showed a snapshot of a yahoo survey before and after they sent out their alert . It showed a totally skewed survey, of course . They pulled that page . The following link shows what they are working on this morning http://giyus.org/alerts/ . Sometimes you must use the oppositions tools . They are clever and organized, that I will give them . Many of the pro-israeli remarks are by their minions.
Comment by Leiif — 7/31/2006 @ 7:49 am
Fellow Human Beings (emphasis thinking rational human beings),
please ignore the incoherant islamic idiotic impoverished depraved comments of Paul and Peace above.
The sorry motherfuckers know not what they mean and what they say. Cause they think not . . . . sorry, they can think not.
Comment by Arjun — 7/31/2006 @ 9:00 am
“The Jewish bandits are despicable cowards who hide behind women and children.” - SS-Gruppenführer Jürgen Stroop on the resistance in the Warsaw Ghetto, 1943.
Comment by alex — 7/31/2006 @ 9:35 am
Peace,
Were you born a pathetic, Nazi anti-Semite? Or did you have to work on it?
Why don’t you take up the cause and go to southern Lebanon? Let the cowards you support issue you a weapon and you too can fight a cowardly fight, by using innocent civilians as a shield.
Comment by LASunsett — 7/31/2006 @ 10:38 am
I’m so glad he’s back.
Looks like he caught them all on a full moon or something, look at all these crazy loopy comments!
Way to go, Rotty, Way to GO!!!
Comment by Cao — 7/31/2006 @ 12:26 pm
This article is being targetted by GIYUS.org
The “Give Israel Your United Support” website is sending people here to give a pro-Israel biased slant to responses to this article.
See here:
http://giyus. org/alerts/
(Remove the space I inserted)
Comment by Bob — 7/31/2006 @ 12:30 pm
I thank the Lord most people can see through the stream of poison you are spewing. I’m sure you would much prefer the completely unbiased reporting of CCN or Fox News which is nothing short of grovelling drivel when it comes to Mr Bush or his sidekick, Mr. ‘Yo’ Blair.
You should be ashamed of yourself for not just believing but spreading Zionist propaganda.
Evil people like you believed Hitler was right even when he committed atrocities.
Comment by buttercup — 7/31/2006 @ 12:32 pm
“Most people”, buttercup?’
Puhleez. that reminds me of hearing Medea Benjamin of Code Pink saying “the majority of Americans agree with us”. Yeah right. What hallucinogenics are you on?
Most people who frequent leftist websites or the beeb, might be in love with Hezbollah, but even then, I don’t swallow that idiotic rhetoric.
Grow up, all the Wide Awakes support Israel and would prefer Israel beat Hezbollah into the ground with no mercy until it says ‘uncle’.
Cheers to Rotty! The moonbats are out in droves! What is it. A full moon?
From David Horowitz’s Jaws of Defeat
Are there terrorists in Iraq? There were none there before George Bush created them. Is Hezbollah a Nazi army? It’s because the Jews “occupied” Palestinian lands. Of course, this is two lies in one. All Israeli “occupation” is the product of four aggressive Arab wars against Israel. When Israel withdraws – as in Lebanon – it is attacked. The source of the terror in Lebanon, as in Iraq, is to be found in the Koran and in the despotisms of the Arab Middle East. But the appeasement camp cannot face the reality that its enemy is implacable and its hatred uncaused by anything its targets – Jews, Christians, “infidels” – have done.
Comment by Cao — 7/31/2006 @ 5:17 pm
Well, it’s certainly instructive to see so many leftists dropping by in order to remove their masks and praise their fellow socialist, Hitler. But don’t you people realise how sick you sound? How utterly twisted and depraved? Because, seriously, I never thought I’d see the day when anyone outside the farthest reaches of the neo-fascist movement openly supported/agreed with the Final Solution. ‘Peace’, you and the others here like you are sick sacks of anti-Semitic filth.
As for the others crazies complaining about GIYUS.org (that’s Give Israel Your United Support) sending people here — Why bother? As Cao says, all of us Wide Awakes are pleased to welcome Zionists here. We all support Israel 110% and are glad to see the GIYUS people show up and help us bash the anti-Semites on the left.
As for the Megaphone tool they’re using to co-ordinate these efforts, I’m already using it to help out, and have done a piece about it at Rottweiler Puppy. Question: why is it that whenever leftists use similar tactics to rally support for a cause, it’s legitimate protest, but when our side does the same, it’s regarded as something sinister?
Whatever. I’d advise everyone to visit GIYUS and make use of their Megaphone in helping Israel at this time.
Comment by RottyPup — 7/31/2006 @ 7:30 pm
Hezbollah, which is hiding behind women and children as they fire rockets at Israel, is directly responsible for all Lebanese civilian deaths.
Any civilian who provides shelter to armed Hezbollah terrorists, is considered a terrorist under international law. Israel has lost many soldiers by trying to protect Lebanese civilians. Hezbollah is destroying Lebanon and her people.
Read this article in the leading Australian newspaper Sunday Herald Sun:
http://www.news.com.au/sundayheraldsun/story/0,,19955774-5007220,00.html
proving how the Hizbollah fighters in southern Lebanon are deliberately fighting from within centers of civilian population, and thereby endangering civilians.
This is a great example both of Hizbollah’s hypocrisy and of how the international media are not exposing the way Hizbollah is cynically endangering the Lebanese population.
Comment by capri — 7/31/2006 @ 9:59 pm
leave a comment that you wana hear but you take of the one you dont wana hear that is vary funy beocose of that you will naver be like the bbc bbc real news from the real world..whin i wough the fox news is like wouging a move
Comment by samsam — 7/31/2006 @ 10:35 pm
This whole debate is so sick. If jews want to live in Israel then please, by all means but at the same time let the poor palestenians live there as well. After all they were there before the whole immigration of Jews to Palestine began. The only honest solution is one state solution, where people of all religions stay together in peace and harmony
Comment by disturbed — 8/1/2006 @ 2:15 am
Wow. It looks as if we’re getting hits from the moonbats from the Guardian’s comment is free — Much whining over Zionist conspiracies, but, strangely, nothing about their fellow crazy’s claim that ‘Hitler was right’. Odd, that.
Comment by RottyPup — 8/1/2006 @ 2:45 am
Terrorism should never be rewarded, but thanks to the appeasers who aren’t listening to them quote their hatred of the infidel from the Koran, who don’t recognize the enemy we face, think that appeasing them is going to do the trick.
Notice how well that worked in the Gaza Strip. After terrorists murdered young pregnant Tali Hatuel and her four daughters in cold blood–Israel declared a withdrawal from that land. Did this cause a ceasefire, as the peace activitists claim ‘negotiating’ would do?
Daniel Pipes: In
We already know from experience with incidents like Mogadishu, and Bin Laden’s comments following that it was then he learned that American is a “paper tiger”-what conclusions they draw from withdrawals and appeasement; they conclude that you’re weak and call on their muslim brothers to wage more jihad against the infidel.
There is only one response to terrorism; and Israel knows this lesson from experience. So should we.
Comment by Cao — 8/1/2006 @ 2:55 am
I’m very disturbed by the nature of the arguments on this page. No one stops to consider the cause they are fighting for. One hates Zionists. The other stands for whoever America stands for, without reason, without question.
Know your enemy. Know why you fight. Know what you stand for. And most importantly, know why.
So to SIMPLIFY, an immensely complex situation:
As far as my knowledge goes, Israeli’s had been banished from Israel in 132 AD.
Between 1881 and world war II, there was massive repolation of the region as Jews LEGALLY bought agricultural wasteland off the Palestinians.
The PALESTINIANS, being Islamist, abhored the notion of a civilisation devoted to another God on their soil. Tensions erupted and conflict began. In 1929, Islamic riots in Palestine murdered over 130 Jews.
The best DEFENCE, is a strong OFFENCE.
If Israel had not retaliated, with extreme mallice, then it, would quite simply, have been whiped off the map.
This applies to Hezbollah, today.
Blind anger is counterproductive to Western values. Know where you direct your anger. Know why. Anything less is Jihad.
Comment by Y2Krashman — 8/1/2006 @ 8:11 am
Good grief. This is the first time I’ve been on this site and it frankly is quite disturbing. The comment by ‘Peace’ is vile, untrue and despicable. Whoever posted that deserves nothing but contempt.
But, for God’s sake, the tortured justifications of child murder, the smashing of homes, the massacres of civilians, the gleeful joy that is evident in some Israelis as they witness their IDF punishing the entire nation of Lebanon for Hizbollah’s campaign of murder. It’s disgraceful that an entire society seems to be contaminated with an inability to see any other side to the situation than the one which validates their own twisted view of the ME conflict. That goes for some Israelis and some Arabs. And, please I know that this is hard for many of you to understand, but being ‘anti Israeli’ is not the same as being anti-semitic. I and millions of others recognise and support Israel’s right to exist, but only within pre 1967 borders. We do not like to policies of the Israeli government This has nothing to do with the Jewish people as an ethnic or religious group. If I criticise Olmert, it does not automatically follow that I hate Jews. Sorry to disappoint the idiots among you who are so arrogant and ignorant to suppose that Jewish = Israeli and vice versa.
As far as the present conflict goes, I have some observations / questions:
1. I have seen no explanation as to why the IDF and the Israeli media first stated that HB ambushed an Israeli patrol just within the Lebanese border and kidnapped 2 Israeli soldiers, then ‘corrected’ this to say that it happened inside Israel. The incontrivertible fact that Israel routinely violated Lebanese territorial integrity - even after the 2000 withdrawal - is ignored.
2. Israel never withdrew totally from Lebanon. The Shebaa Farms area is still under Israeli occupation. Hizbollah says that this is one of the reasons for its continued attacks on Israeli territory. Please, before people start calling me an anti-semitic Nazi for pointing that out, I do not support Hizbollah at all. If every one of them dropped dead right this minute, the world would immediately be a better place. But lies beget lies. Israel lies about Hizbollah, and Hizbollah lies about Israel.
3. Why do many Israelis not consider the fact that the murder (collateral damage, accidental killing blah blah - International law says it’s murder, so that’s what it is) of Lebanese civilians by the IDF is exactly what the Hizbollah leadership and their paymasters in Damascus and Tehran want? This is the best possible recruiting aid for HB. There are currently hundreds of young Arab and Persian men who are trying to get to Syria and thence to Southern Lebanon to fight alongside their HB ‘brothers’. For every 10 young Lebanese males who lose a civilian relative or friend to the IDF, how many will *not* support HB in future elections in Lebanon, how many will actually join HB to fight? I do not think the answer would please Israelis.
4. Some Israelis seem to think that they must crush and militarily defeat Hizbollah, Hamas, Islamic Jihad and any other insurgent/terrorist/resistance/militant Arab movement that is active in a neighboring country or within the occupied territories. How is this to be achieved? Are there some people in Israel who actually consider this to be possible? I’m sure that every proffessional miltary strategist outside Tel Aviv would just love to know how this is to be done. Maybe Israel could make a lot of money by selling their Patented Method for the Complete & Utter Defeat of Terrorist Bad Guys to the rest of the world. We all know what a great job Shin Bet, the Israeli police and the IDF have done in totally eradicating terrorism inside Israel.
Bad jokes aside, why do some Israelis seem to think that only war to the bitter end is the only way forward. Are they so stupid? BTW, if this were an Arab site I would have asked similar questions and made similar observations (- to an outsider like me, you are far more similar to your Arab cousins than you seem to think.)
Hamas and Fatah prisoners in Israeli jails have called for the recognition of Israel. This was widely reported just before other, more intransigent, elements in Hamas organised the kidnapping of the Israeli soldier just outside Gaza. Since then, we have had Israeli reprisals, Hizbollah kidnap-Israeli-soldiers bandwagon climbing and rocket attacks and the new war in Lebanon. Arms manufacturers in Israel, Iran and the USA must all be very happy.
There are possibilites for a lasting peace with Palestinians. It will require sacrifices by Israel in land and money. But don’t worry - you still get the best end of the deal, Israel will have to give far less than the Palestinians have already had taken from them. It’s your only chance of achieving peace. Otherwise you can look forward to having to use that nuclear option you keep so ’secret’ - just to take as many Arabs as you can with you into oblivion.
Comment by Bill — 8/1/2006 @ 8:28 am
Bravo Bill, balanced & logical comments! I was also shocked to come across this site & read the hatred & racism on display (probably the same sort of content you’d find on a neo-Nazi site?).
I am struck by the fact that all the ‘foamers’ or ‘fundies’ that spout their bile here, either against Israel or the Arabs, are probably sitting comfortable & alone in their bedrooms imagining that war is a great adventure because they’ve had a few too many late-night sessions on Counter-Strike.
When these moronic chickenhawks actually start going out to fight Bush’s ideological oil wars, or start losing their friends & families to precision guided bombs, then the posts might become a bit more considered.
Comment by quaggashole — 8/1/2006 @ 12:21 pm
You people have been around around for 3000 years and you still haven’t manage to pull your heads out of your asses.
You repeated the names of your 3 abducted soldiers a million times. Does any of you care to know the names of those children as well. They are of course not jewish but they they are still not any less human then you.
Comment by Eosforos Iapeteides — 8/2/2006 @ 9:36 am
Israel is fucking pathetic…..its a biased coverage or anti-semite if it doesn’t praise Israel’s every move. That county has got to change soon…cause i am part of a growing number of Americans who are beginning to really question our stupid alliance with such a blood-thirsty nation
Comment by Anti-Israeli American — 8/2/2006 @ 10:30 am
To all.
I would like to inform you that your message board has been hijacked by giyus.org. This is a Zionist internet computer system designed by the Israeli government to attack any criticism to Israel and its madness. On this website they have a program which I downloaded and installed that gives to the user any updates on conversations, online polls, newspaper clips or blogs in which Israel is being discussed especially in a critical way. Then they urge you to respond. This creates a perception that more people than in reality agree with Zionism and Israel in general. This is how I got to this blog. Please download the program yourself and let everyone know that Israel has hijacked their legitimate discussion to create “false” public opinion.
GIYUS.ORG = Zionist propoganda
Mosestruth
Comment by Tim — 8/2/2006 @ 9:07 pm
The aggressive nature of your Anti-Israeli’s argument seems to be the product of a “blood-thirsty” regime itself. What is this movement? Is it an organization dedicated to the notion of Jihad? Therefore being “blood-thirsty” just by its very notion.
Violence is bad. Violence perpetrated in the name of religion is bad. Israel has made errors in the way it has defended itself. But its conduct, however brutal was in the name of SELF PRESERVATION.
As long as fundamentalists wish to erase Israel from the map, then the nation will continue to retalliate.
And that’s why conflict within this stupid Holy region will never end. Ever.
Israel has the right to defend herself.
To support either cause here is to be “blood-thirsty”.
Comment by Y2Krashman — 8/3/2006 @ 5:57 am
You mean, ‘To my fellow moonbat trolls’, don’t you?
That’s Give Israel Your United Support, and, as for being ‘hijacked’, well, that would really be quite difficult — I’m a member of GIYUS. So go figure.
Actually, it’s a messaging service run by Israeli students, but, please, don’t trouble yourself with minor details if they interfere with a juicy conspiracy theory. Twit.
As I said, it’s a pro-Israeli messaging service. And, since I’m a member of GIYUS, and since this post isn’t exactly ‘critical’ of Israel, your point is kind of redundant, don’t you think?
… This is as opposed to all of the left-wing political activists who urge their supporters not to respond?
Either that, or it helps to get the truth out to a population consistently lied to by MSM. See, this ‘evil, conniving Joooos’ argument you’re peddling would work better if your Islamofascist pals weren’t so hopelessly inept when they try to stage an ‘Israeli war-crime’.
Yes. Please do. It’s fantastically useful, as this footage of the IDF in action goes to show.
How is this ‘false’ public opinion? We’re members of the public, and we’re giving our opinions. You leftists are perfectly welcome to do the same, though it would be nice if you’d come up with a messaging service of your own — You know, as opposed to ‘hijacking’ someone else’s. Oh. Wait. Now I get it — Anything more complex than painting a ‘Bushitler’ placard in between puffs on a joint is beyond you pea-brains.
Tim = Someone who spells like a 2nd grader. It’s propaganda.
Comment by RottyPup — 8/3/2006 @ 8:20 am
“You know, as opposed to ‘hijacking’ someone else’s. Oh. Wait. Now I get it — Anything more complex than painting a ‘Bushitler’ placard in between puffs on a joint is beyond you pea-brains.” -RottyPup.
Someone has to oppose the agressive, fascist propaganda crap promoted on dangerous web sites such as… you guessed it. This one. Yay!!!
Pea brained? I’m sorry, but most people who stand up for their own, personal, beliefs, tend to be significantly more… intelligent, than those who follow like sheep (Rightist-moron-fundie. Ahem.) Go figure.
Comment by Y2Krashman — 8/3/2006 @ 10:31 am
You want ‘aggressive’, moonbat? You want ‘fascist’? Well, then, try this on for size. See, this is what I really can’t fathom about you people (and, seriously, I’d like an answer) — How is it that, as a peace ‘n’ love ‘n’ understanding lefty you can find any common ground at all with Islamopaths? I mean, these people are practicing the kind of off-the-scale fascism that would see:
Now, although you probably think that GW’s a prat, Tony Blair’s a poodle and Israel are heavy-handed, surely the reality of the evil on the other side must get through to you? Surely you can’t be that blind?
… Or maybe you can. Only, please, don’t call what you’re doing ‘intelligence’ — That insults my own.
Comment by RottyPup — 8/3/2006 @ 10:57 am
RottyPup, do not operate, for one second under the assumption that you know anything about me or where I am coming from. My voice is my own. And I seek to quieten the voices of injustice wherever I may find them.
There, that said, we should all sit down, have an injection of thorazine, and a cup of camomile-freakin-tea.
I am well aware of the extremist beliefs of all fundamentalists on both sides of the geopolitical world table. And all are dangerous regimes. Yes one is more sociopathic and genocidal than the other. But it’s the freedoms they both seek so vehemently to dispel, that I despise.
Technically yes, I am an Islamophobe. I hate to admit it. And I wish were not the case. I wish I could broaden my horizons, and understand the greater equilibrium of the world’s Islamic culture. But alas, I cannot. I have witnessed, fought against and worked with their kind. But they are people. We must tar their beliefs, and not their persons. What is your notion RottyPup, that we relinquish genocide upon them by thumbing the nuclear option?
Of course freedom should be fought for at all cost, for existence has no value if not conjoined with liberty. But humans are humans, and the only two possible options we have on the table, in regards to expunging the eternal middle-eastern conflicts are:
Education Extermination
I’m not in the global political arena, so I am not privy to the execution of such options. But to wave a banner in support of bloody destruction is to stoop to the level of that which you so clearly despise Rotty.
Political correctness must be vanquished in the notions of national defence. I’m Australian. I’m also a lifeguard.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_Cronulla_riots
So my stance should be clear. Hatred however, begets hatred. Attempt to stipulate, educate and cooperate. Before you obliterate. Y’down with that?
Comment by Y2Krashman — 8/3/2006 @ 11:31 am
Alrighty, then. Your stance is clear. And — what do you know? — It’s the same as every other Wide Awake.
See, much as our blood might boil over things like 9/11, 7/7 and Bali, there’s nobody here who actively seeks warfare with anyone.
The difference between conservatives and leftists isn’t that we’re more inherently bloodthirsty than you are — It’s that we grasp the fact that sometimes warfare is unavoidable, and, given that fact, that it’s best to just pitch in and prosecute the damn thing to the best of our ability. What leftists don’t seem to grasp is that if the war has to be fought (and if you listen to the filthy, anti-everything ranting coming out of the ME, you’ll realise it does), then your constant objections interfere with our ability to win the thing as quickly and cleanly as we can
Every, single time you guys yelp about Gitmo, or soldiers being too quick on the trigger, or Israel using disproportionate force, You. Slow. Us. Down. Maybe you think that’s a good thing? Well, then, let’s hear from the other side in the conflict. What do they think about peace ‘n’ love ‘n’ human rights?
It’s not about asking whether or not we should make peace with that … thing — It’s about whether any even remotely civilised human being could could make peace with it.
Are we understanding one another now?
Comment by RottyPup — 8/3/2006 @ 12:48 pm
Well, c’mon now, Y2Krashman … Don’t you have a clever comeback? Anyone? Damn, but maybe you lefties aren’t so ‘intelligent’ after all.
Comment by RottyPup — 8/3/2006 @ 2:57 pm
War was avoidable Rottypup. War is always avoidable. I think what you mean to say is that war is sometimes the lesser evil. Such is not the case here. Israel could have gone after Hezbollah in a a ground offensive that would have prevented such massive destruction of Lebanaon’s infrastructure and the killing of so many civilians. They did not want to risk the number of soldiers that would have required. So in order to make war safer for them they decided to make war not just on Hezbollah but on Lebanonese civilians and infrastructure. They stupidly thought the Lebanese would turn against Hezbollah or maybe they are just subscribing to the notion of kill Hezbollah and kill the women who might produce more Hezbollah and the children who might grow up to be Hezbollah. You know a cleansing. I heard their representative at the UN remark that they weren’t concerned if their actions caused more Lebanese to hate them or spawn a new generation of Hezbollah because their children already hated them. I found that remark to be profoundly disturbing. If American Southerners had adopted that attitude we would still be lynching negros today. Children taught to hate can and do in many instances learn to unhate when given no cause to hate. This war is a disaster and Israel’s response has been immoral.
Palestinians are Palestinians because they are from the land called Palistine. Duh. In America people from Germany, Sweden, AFrica, France, England etc. are called Americans because we live in America. When these people immigrated to America they brought different languages, different cultures, different religions but they were and are still Americans.
Comment by Carol — 8/3/2006 @ 7:27 pm
And what is this “us” crap? You aren’t American.
Comment by Carol — 8/3/2006 @ 7:33 pm
No clever come back. Okay RottyPup, gettin a little eager to dance? So then let’s dance.
As I have indicated in previous posts, I was a would-be commando. I spent months reading SAS tactical handbooks, combat tactics, weapons logistics etc… I trained for three hours a day, every day. I participated in gym boot camp scenarios. My best mate and I were going to join. He is now a Special Forces operator. Fortunately, or unfortunately other career opportunities have presented themselves.
So as you can see, not all ‘lefties’ are as pacifistic as your broad, ignorant notions would have you believe Rotty. However, if I’m going to take up a cause, then I like to know that which I fight for. And there better be a bloody good reason. My resolve isn’t to Kill, Kill Kill. I’m not so mindlessly barbaric. So therefore my stance is not the same as the majority of wide awakes. And my stance is definetly not the same as yours. Leftists slow you down? From what initiating the next holocaust? Being the harbinger of the apocalypse? World war III? Gimme a break moron.
Some war is inevitable. Some conflicts unavoidable. Self defense requires immediate action and not bureaucracy. However, I personally believe that Israel could have minimized its body count. It could have targeted power grids, nodes and network stations. It could brought the entire country to a halt and said: “Eliminate Hezbollah units from your territory, or we will ensure your blackouts are a less temporary situation.” Lebanon would have been forced to comply. The body count would not have exceeded 900 civillians. But hey, I’m no tactician, Field Marshal, Brigadier or Defence Secretary.
It’s indisputably clear to me, from the agression of your prose and argumentative style, that have genocidal desires. That you are perhaps racist (I assume), and that you have an eye for an eye mentality.
Israel must defend herself. But she also must weigh up the costs. Perhaps or humanitarian aid was perpetrated by Israel throughout Palestine, the situation would still exist, but would quelled somewhat. There is no answer to war in the birthplace of Judaism, Christianity and Islam. There will always be conflict. No buts. No questions. But can we minimize the blood shed. Yes. Yes we can.
However, as long war mongers are twitchy with their trigger fingers, then the situation will always reach impasse.
Clever comeback? Primed it, timed it and threw it across the line with buddy.
As for anyone else addressing the authenticity of my global stance. I’m a dual a citizen of both the US and Australia. I was born In Dayton, Ohio
Comment by Y2Krashman — 8/4/2006 @ 1:16 am
Typed my previous post up a lil’ quick, and didn’t proof read. But y’all get my point now y’hear?
Comment by Y2Krashman — 8/4/2006 @ 1:19 am
He is a part of the international conservative movement, Carol…”we” are always “we”, whether you like it or not.
I don’t think anywhere in that paragraph you could construe Rotty is claiming that he’s an American.
What’s the matter, Carol, getting a little sensitive about Rotty being a part of our group?
Comment by Cao — 8/4/2006 @ 3:34 am
Comment by Cao — 8/4/2006 @ 3:36 am
Are all your analyses this half-assed?
A proper debate without the diatribe would be so much more effective.
You do the right wing agenda no favours with this level of discussion.
Rajeev S, London
Comment by Rajeev — 8/5/2006 @ 6:37 am
Are all your comments troll turds?
Comment by Cao — 8/5/2006 @ 7:12 am